Comments for: Right and wrong on ObamaCare

Posted March 19, 2012, at 3:19 p.m.

Nancy Pelosi was right. In March of 2010 the Democratic Speaker of the House said, “We have to pass the bill so you can find out what is in it.” She was referring to the now infamous Affordable Care Act, aka ObamaCare. Only a privileged few had a clue what …

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  • Anonymous

    the real issue and I am sure that the writer can relate, is with insurance. I believe United Health is now either under it’s second or third CEO in the last 5 years who pull in close to $100 million a year. And what value add does that guy do again? Everything else in this article is true.

    • Anonymous

      I pay $400 a month in premiums now. I can hardly wait to pay $600. This is on top of the $24,000 in income taxes I pay every year. Yippie!

      • Anonymous

        Politically right is more than happy to help pay for it, ask him/her.

      • Anonymous

        Want lower taxes?  OK, have millionaires and billionaires pay more than 14% on their investment income, especially when they hide it in the Caymans.  End corporate tax loopholes.  End the billions in tax subsidies to the oil corporations, and others too.  And seriously reduce the military industrial complex and invest in real job creation.  Then your taxes will be even low than with the tax CUTS you’ve already received under President Obama.

        • Anonymous

           Good luck changing the offshore loopholes when Rochelle Pingree and her pal $U$$MAN are heavily invested in offshore tax shelters. 

    • Anonymous

      Health insurance companies’ profits are only a small part of the overall cost of healthcare in the US. 

      • Anonymous

        Hogwash.  They often pull out 30 cents on the dollar.  The big insurance company CEO’s make tens to hundreds of millions of dollars a year, and many own multiple mansions.  But as a right winger I’m sure you’d say that’s just fine.  Give one guy millions of dollars and let millions of Americans go without healthcare.  Fine and dandy for the right wing.  Whatever is best for their corporate masters, the American middle class be damned.  Well, we’ll see you at the voting booth.

        • Anonymous

          My aren’t we angry – And wrong.

  • Anonymous

    Canada – run by Conservatives – Universal Health Care
     
    Britain – run by Conservatives – Universal Health Care
     
    France – run by Conservatives – Universal Health Care
     
    Germany – run by Conservatives – Universal Health Care
     
    Here’s a statement from the British Conservative Party website:
     
    “We are committed to an NHS that is free at the point of use and available to everyone based on need, not the ability to pay.”
     
    http://www.conservatives.com/Policy/Where_we_stand/Health.aspx
     
    And this from the Canadian Conservative Party Platform:
     
    “Stephen Harper’s Government is committed to a universal public
    health care system and the Canada Health Act,”
     
    http://www.conservative.ca/media/ConservativePlatform2011_ENs.pdf
     
     
    Universal Health Care isn’t Socialist or even Liberal, it’s just civilized.

    Only in the United States, where conservatives are so far to the right, is there a political party that is against Universal Health Care. 

    Providing police protection, providing fire department protection, providing health care protection are government functions in the rest of the civilized world.  The difference here is the money that Big Pharma and insurance companies use to convince us otherwise.

    • Guest

      Most of the civilized world is slowly collapsing economically and  jumping off the cliff created by socialist policies.   And Progressives in this county like you want us to jump off that same cliff.

      • Anonymous

        Most of the civilized world outside of the US spends less of their GDP on healthcare than we do but manage to cover all their citizens.   No need to jump off any cliffs here when 45,000 a year die in this country due to lack of health care.  And we call ourselves civilized.  There’s no excuse for a country as wealthy as the USA to NOT have healthcare for all.   That we allow drug and insurance companies to profit as much as they do is criminal.    

        • Anonymous

          All the government needed to do was to insure those folks who did NOT have coverage – not 300 million of us.  Much more doable & affordable than Obama’s takeover.

          • Anonymous

             Where do you get your information???  The Affordable Care Act does not take over any existing insurance plans, instead it makes insurance available to those who do not have it through insurance exchanges and thereby ensures that all those who are currently uninsured are able to pay for care.  This is intended to protect us from the need of hospitals to charge us all more to compensate for all the unpaid care they are compelled to provide.   It’s the design of the Heritage Foundation, a conservative think-tank, and an obvious compromise on the part of the President and Democrats in Congress. 

      • Anonymous

        Right wing propaganda.  Your ultra failed “trickled-on” corporate pro-rich-attack-the-middle-class policies have driven away our jobs, concentrated wealth into the hands of the few, shrunk the middle class, and most recently caused the Republican Great Recession.  All you right wingers care about is helping your corporate masters own more mansions while the American middle class is squeezed out of existence.  Well, we’ll see you at the voting booth. Come November, your party is TOAST.

    • Anonymous

      I will point out the problem by using your own quote “We are committed to an NHS that is free at the point of use and available to everyone based on need, not the ability to pay.”..

      It is not free. The price our gov said at the start has already more then doubled and if allowed to continue will go up exponentially.

      Those of us who have actually been overseas and seen the system they have first hand  do not want it. Many of those who have it do not want it. This is the main reason I am opposed to it. It offers no choice and by the very implementation of it all private insurance companies will before to long cease to exist.

      • Anonymous

        Having health insurance companies disappear would be the biggest benefit of all.  Many against this argue they don’t want “a government beauracracy” managing their health.  Right now you are letting an insurance industry beauracracy do just that and make obscene profits.  Obscene in the amount and in the fact they are profiting from sickness and misery of others.  

        • Anonymous

          Exactly.  Capitalism on steriods.

        • Anonymous

          Be careful what you wish for.

        • Anonymous

          Right now you can buy the insurance YOU want to buy. The private insurance companies give you a plan and you pick the one you want and that is what you get. If the government gets control of it then you get what they say and will not have the ability to CHOOSE a different plan. Ask the people who live in the UK or Canada how great there system is. Need a xray wait 6 months to get in. When the private sector or you personally control  it you get what your want when YOU want it. You want some bureaucrat deciding your heath issues? 

  • Anonymous

    Well said, Representative McKane. Your arguments are strong indeed. The strongest argumnet against Obama/Pelosicare is its unconstitutionality regarding the individual mandate.

  • Anonymous

    The core problem in US health-care system is that it is built around the profit motive. That may be OK for some aspects such as cutting-edge research and technology or physicians with outstanding talents or skills, it is not OK for insurers, hospital administrators and all other routine aspects of health-care. Taking advantage of the illnesses of others is morally repugnant. Yet we have a system that is built around the elimination of the weakest and the most vulnerable from the insurance pool. Is it any wonder that many Americans want government involved to regulate health care? 

    • Anonymous

      Same with the food industry, clothing industry and housing industry, eh, pizanos? How could anyone make a profit on those things that people must have to live! Collective farms are the only honest answer!

      • Anonymous

        A cynical analogy, and a false one at that.  Healthy people can work to pay for their food and housing but sick people often can’t do so adequately. Exploiting them for fat pay-checks is not the way civilized nations manage their health-care systems. Lepper colonies aren’t the answer.

        • Anonymous

          Sorry, health care is not a “right” anymore than those other necessities are.

          • Anonymous

            It has nothing to do with rights and everything with morality.

          • Anonymous

            Well that is the discussion isn’t it ?   Those who believe as I do that it is and should be a ‘right’ and those who do not.   Basic value judgments.

          • Anonymous

            How can healthcare be a right and not food?

          • Anonymous

            You are twisting my words.  If anyone cannot afford money for food, then of course they should be helped.  Would you have them starve ?

          • Guest

            If they are capable of working and choose not to then yes.  Let them starve.

          • Guest

            When you make anything a “right” you are telling  people they are entitled to it with no obligation to pay for it.  So tell me, when everyone finally figures that out and no one pays for it any more then just who is going to pay and how are you going to deliver that “right” to the people?

          • Anonymous

            Not at all.  I did not say that it should be free for all, but those who cannot afford it should not be denied healthcare.  They will need their care subsidized.  I cannot believe that you do not realize that they are already in ‘the system’ in a non transparent fashion.  The Affordable Care
            Act brings them out of the shadows and honestly looks at the actual costs.

          • Guest

            If it is a “right” and free for one then it should be free for all.  That is equality or equal justice under the law.  Anything else would be discrimination.

            You have not answered the question of who and how this “right” is going to be paid for.

            If you get over the illogical, Utopian, idea that health care, (and any other product or service for that matter), is a  right and that people are responsible to pay for products and services they consume then the whole problem goes away.

          • Anonymous

            We disagree.

  • Anonymous

    Twenty years ago, Switzerland had a system very similar to America’s – private insurers, private providers – with very similar problems. People didn’t buy insurance but ended up in emergency rooms, insurers screened out people with pre-existing conditions, and costs were rising fast. The country came to the conclusion that to make health care work, everyone had to buy insurance. So the Swiss passed an individual mandate and reformed their system along lines very similar to Obamacare. The reform law passed by referendum, narrowly.The result two decades later: quality of care remains very high, everyone has access, and costs have moderated. Switzerland spends 11% of its GDP on health care, compared with 17% in the U.S. Its 8 million people have health care that is not tied to their employers, they can choose among many plans, and they can switch plans every year. Overall satisfaction with the system is high.

    Fareed Zakaria had an excellent show that’s airing again on Saturday @ 8 http://globalpublicsquare.blogs.cnn.com

    • Anonymous

      Switzerland has a homogeneous population less than that of Virginia. What might work on a state level is not guaranteed to work on a national level, especially in a nation of over 300,000,000.

      • Anonymous

        actually, I think it’s harder with less people than with more.

        • Guest

          Switzerland is extremely wealthy with little or no underclass

          • Anonymous

            But they are paying less per person for excellent coverage than the US does for much poorer results for fewer people.

    • Anonymous

      The success in Switzerland is an excellent example of the way this should get done.   For one thing while they have kept their private insurance providers, these providers are carefully and intelligently regulated.

    • Anonymous

      Fareed Zakaria is in Obama’s back pocket.

      • Anonymous

         I hope the President listens to Zakaria–he’s smarter than the entire Republican ‘brain-trust.’

  • Anonymous

    Obama please resign – you have no respect from anyone in the world,
    including everyone in the United States…the only votes you get are
    those who you bribe with free stuff to get them to vote for you (hence ObamaCare).  

  • Anonymous

    Like all things medical science is not perfect, Yet we demand perfection when we go under the knife.  When something goes wrong, and it it will, there are an army of lawyers ready to rip into everyone involved with that establishment.  
    100 years ago we didn’t have penicillin.  We have been increasing our medical knowledge and technology exponentially every year.  We can now replace a heart with an artificial heart which, arguably, is better than a human heart.   These break throughs cost a great deal in research, test and develop. These technologies have caused life expectancy to continually rise in developed nations.These are some of the reason medical care costs so much.   

  • Anonymous

    “Only a privileged few had a clue what was in this massive bill then and the rest of us are still finding out.”

    Mr. McKane either doesn’t care about the truth or he’s knowingly lying.   The health care bill was posted on line for a considerable time before the vote, and there was considerable discussion about it in congress and in front of the media. Anyone who wanted to read the bill could do so if they had access to the internet. (This is the same bill Republicans told voters had “death panels” in it.)

    McKane’s untruth about Pelosi stems from a three-second video someone posted from a half-hour speech. The cowards didn’t even have the courage to post the whole sentence. Pelosi was speaking to a group of county government officials,  and she was saying to them that, as they well knew, it is sometimes hard to know what is in a bill when so much misinformation is being spread about it by its opponents.

    Hundreds of conservative sites unquestioningly mirrored that three-second video as “proof” that Pelosi had ordered legislators not to read the bill, just to pass it.  No politician who wanted to keep a job would tell people not to read a bill, just to sign off on it. This, of course, doesn’t matter to people like McKane, who believe the facts are secondary to the Republican Party talking points.

    Should any of this article be believed when the author couldn’t get through the first sentence without telling an untruth?

    • Anonymous

      Pelosi said it – but who cares, that’s not the point – although it is true – we still don’t have a clue what is in it because it changes on a weekly basis. You can only find fault with that one little one-liner that’s been repeated ad nauseum which was used essentially to get readers attention to read the column. This says to me that everything McKane says is right on.

      ObamaCare is another dangerous and expensive venture into healthcare bureacracy. We’ve tried it with Dirigo. It failed.

    • Anonymous

      See my post above.  McKane and the right wing in general don’t know how to tell the truth.  They are walking LIARS and LIE to con people all in support of their corporate masters.

      • Anonymous

        Corporate masters? Watch out for the black helicopters, Tinser.

  • Anonymous

    Thank goodness this corporate toady McKane is terming out. He needs to be very very gone.  He is one of the nutcases who howled and howled with crazy LIES about there being “fraud fraud fraud, bla bla bla” in our election system so we needed to end same day voting registration.  Well, we answered that LIE didn’t we?  Crushed him as the voting booth over that LIE, and come November his party is toast again.  The Affordable Care Act is FULL of measures that Republicans, even the Heritage Foundation, used to support before Obama was elected and they went ultraTeaNutCrazy.  They used to support exchanges, a way to increase competition through the marketplace, and they used to support as a very principle allowing the states to set them up and run them. Indeed, the Affordable Care Act LOWERS costs and SAVES many billions of dollars over time.  It is also very similar to the law that the current Republican presidential frontrunner Mitt Romney touted in Massachusetts as a “national model”.   That is just one more testament to how moderate this bill is.  It is NOT a “government takeover” of healthcare.  What a LIE.  Pure and utter LIE.  It maintains the PRIVATE system.  And of course McKane and the right wingers just hate that it does eliminate the ability of the corporate insurance companies to throw millions of people off healthcare for pre-existing conditions or when they have the gall to actually get sick.  And everyone knows that the sham pro-corporate bill the Republicans forced on us in Maine, most of them without even reading it, is another giveaway to the insurance corporations and is already increasing the rates of rural Mainers.  McKane is a right wing LIAR whose party is a wholey-owned subsidiary of the corrupt corporate insurance industry which sucks thirty cents in profit out of every premium dollar.  McKane and Republicans just want their corporate master insurance CEOs to have more mansions and Cadillacs, like their water boy RoMONEY who flips like a fish out of water pandering to whatever audience he’s in front of and who creates NO jobs with his hostile takeover money invested offshore in the Caymans. Job creators? Ya right. Job KILLERS is more like it. THAT is the GOP.

    • Anonymous

      THANK YOU Tinserblic!!!  Finally some sanity and sensibility.  It’s so discouraging seeing all the misinformation, hatred and animosity.  

    • Anonymous

      All we seem to get from the left nowadays is misinformation, hatred and animosity. Well, it worked for Goebels. 

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