September 24, 2017
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Comments for: Environmental group assails DEP for choice of mining rules rewrite consultant

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  • Anonymous

    this in itself is the scary part: “Rep. John Martin, D-Eagle Lake, who lost his bid for re-election last month, sponsored the mining-related legislation. Martin’s bill stirred up controversy in The County among supporters and opponents of the concept.”

  • Anonymous

    And in other news out of Augusta today. It was announced that Mr. Slyy Foxx has been appointed as director of security for all of Maines Poultry domiciles.

    • Anonymous

      yeah because uneducated lay-people such as yourself have so, so much more knowledge when it comes the mining industry and environmental best management practices

      give me a break, if the environemtal whackjobs like crybaby Didisheim had theier way, groups like Earthfirst and CBR would be writing our regs and we’d be living in the stone age, buring wood and using shells for money..

      • Anonymous

        I am sure you are correct when you say I am uneducated. I guess earning two undergraduate degrees in engineering (mechanical and civil) as well as a masters in mechanical engineering would qualify me as uneducated. I am sure my educational accomplishments would be considered inferior to an individual such as yourself who it would appear seems to know everything about everything and everyone. Oh by the way what do the words, “buring”, “environemtal” and “theier” mean? I don’t seem to recall those being words I had to learn in grade school vocabulary.

        • Anonymous

          Those who brag about their degrees usually didn’t learn much while getting them.

          • Anonymous

            You might be right. Almost everyday I learn something about my profession I didn’t know. Fortunately for me and my family I have been able to make a very good living within the profession you imply I learned very little about. Oh and by the way it wasn’t bragging. I was simply pointing out to the poster I responded to that I did have some limited knowledge of the subject matter.

      • Anonymous

        Nope, burning wood is polluting. we would all just have to freeze to death and help save the planet from man.

      • Bill Cat

        Got a PhD to go with all that self-importance, pally?

    • Anonymous

      No doubt you would have been much happier had DEP chosen the Sierra Club to develop mining regulations for Maine; the Sierra Club of course would have produced a much more balanced set of recommendations (irony intended).

      • Anonymous

        Oh yes another individual who seems to be able to say what others are thinking. Having the Sierra Club develop the rules for mining would have been insanity. Every State in the Nation as well as the Federal Government has rules pertaining to mining. I am sure Maine could have adopted rules using those guidelines with a few modifications, if necessary, to adapt to Maine’s unique needs.

        • Anonymous

          What are Maine’s Unique needs? Why can’t EPA rules alone do the job?

          • Anonymous

            I said if necessary

          • Anonymous

            Yeah I thought you might say something like that.

  • Anonymous

    Anyone else surprised that the LePage administration went with a choice that would be heavily slanted towards the mining companies and completely deaf towards environmental concerns? Maine, open for a screwing.

    • Anonymous

      more like: Maine, screwing business, jobs, and its people

  • Anonymous

    If an environmental advocacy group is outraged….it must be good for business and create jobs.

    • Anonymous

      truly_simple.

    • Anonymous

      The environment is the only thing left going for Maine, so let’s kill that too, in the name of jobs. Anyone who would put their own welfare above this beautiful state should move to New Jersey and work. Plenty of jobs down there.

      • Anonymous

        Conversely, anyone that would put the welfare of Maine’s people, and their livelihood beneath the resilient environment, might want to re-asses their thinking.

        • Anonymous

          How many Mainers currently or in the future will derive their livelihood from mining? And that wasn’t meant as a smart assed question. Something tells me that the benefit to Mainers is no where close to what former Rep Martin sold the last legislature.

          • Anonymous

            Not taken as a smart assed question, and the answer is ….I have no idea. That being said, when there is a possibilty of creating,as the article stated…..”could create hundreds of jobs”, it’s worth looking into.

          • Guest

            Destruction of our Maine environment would destroy Maine.
            We have already had enough Love Canals and rivers that burned.

          • Anonymous

            I agree that anything that could produce hundreds of jobs should be looked into. However when the person making the claim is John Martin and the primary beneficiary of the legislation is the family of someone he is deeply in debt to I have to question it. Not discard it but question it.

          • Anonymous

            Couldn’t agree more, there is a place known as ”common ground”, and I belive we’ve found it.

          • Anonymous

            I wonder if there was someone like you in North Dakota a couple of decades ago saying ” How many people here will ever make a living drilling?”

        • Anonymous

          People. Environment. Long term, you can’t separate the two. It’s really simple.

  • Anonymous

    Is the LePAGE DEP motto ” To hell with the chickens, hire the fox!” ?

  • Anonymous

    NRCM

    Not Really Caring for Maine.

  • Anonymous

    The World Bank recently announced that there is a decent chance humanity will collapse–due to environmental change because of development. If you know what the World Bank is, you won’t call them liberal.

    So, enjoy your cheap jobs while you can, and don’t blame anyone but yourself as the world we live in continues to decline.

    http://www.washingtonpost.com/business/economy/world-bank-warns-of-4-degree-threshhold/2012/11/19/aa298dd0-3023-11e2-a30e-5ca76eeec857_story.html

    • Anonymous

      any world anything has an agenda everytime they speak

    • Anonymous

      Liberal? no but progressive and elitist absolutly

  • Anonymous

    Let’s let the fox make up the rules for the hen house.

  • Guest

    Some people would like to take this country back to the days [not that long ago] when the rivers ran brown [green] and covered with scummy foam.

    • Anonymous

      I don’t believe that for a minute. I know no one who wants that.. I don’t believe they should allow corporate write lthe laws though..

      • Guest

        ……

  • Lord Whiteman

    The Michigan Chamber of Commerce mysteriously gave gave $225,000 to Lepage’s 2010 election campaign. Could this be what they bought with their money?

    • Anonymous

      Where did you find this number?

      So you expect me to believe that the Michigan Chamber of Commerce donated $225,000 to a campaign (strange because that is only $224,250 more than a maximum contribution) in the hope that one day one of their business members may receive a contract that is $50,000 less than that donation?

      Or are you spreading false lies and rumors in order to smear someone politically?

      • Guest
      • Lord Whiteman

        Back in 2010, I wondered why the Michigan chamber of commerce would give 1/4 of a million dollars to the Maine Republican Governor’s Association.
        At first I thought Lepage was given this money to let Kestrel aircraft factory move from Maine to Wisconsin, but now it is my opinion the money came from Canadian mining companies and was funneled to Lepage by the Chamber of commerce.
        If I’m correct we can expect to see only Canadians hired to work at the mine in the same way that no Americans where hired to build the Keystone pipeline.

    • Anonymous

      Thank you, Lord Whiteman, if LePage’s campaign did get that much, wow…we should all smell fish!

    • Oh My Goodness..if that is true that explains MUCH!!!! Do you have a link we can look at?

      I couldn’t imagine when I saw North Jacksons profile and experience at their own website how and why they would possible even Know about our reg or our statute let alone make tis unlikely bid on our RFP. Actual real world experts hadn’t even seen the rfp or heard about our statutory changes

      See my accounto above of my “down the rabbit hole” round with Samatha DePoy Warren and George Mac Donald on the procurement process itself.

      You have pointed right to center and source of lal this if what you say is true.

      • Just saw the link provided by an anonymous logger above.. Yes that’s it.!!

        So There has to be a single company that has both mining interests in michigan and mining interets here at one or mor eof ur site..Alder Bond. Mt. Chase and Blad Mounntain.

        Must be Bald Mountain as lal this came through JD Irving. So there is some company in Michigan who orchestrated all this to advance its existing finnacial inyerests here in Maine.

        The last mining company of record at Bal Mountain purchase a lease from another company for $2million and actually had developed a comprehensive plan for Bald Mountain involving open pit sulfide mining and cyanide heap leach processing..Black Hawk Mining Co..a Toronoto based company.

        Don’t know whether Black Hawk still hold that lease or not but I believe their exploration permit from LUPC is long expired It was transferred to them by permit from LUPC in 1998. LUPC says they have no record of a pre application meeting or for an actual application for a rezoning to create a DPD mining district at Bald Mountain. Also don’t kow what their connection might be to Michigan.

        Any other possible links anyone can think of that might be worth running down?

        Could whoever this company is, the one that must have a common connection between Michigan and Maine be the unknown “private investor” who bailed out John martin in is recent bankruptcy case..My mind doesn’t usually run in that direction but in this case it all just seems to connect itself up into one big invasive organism.

        • Anonymous

          Wow, paranoid much? Have you info on the new regs that no one else does? Are you aware of a mining plan submitted? Or do you rely on anti Lepage sites for your info, such as the one posted.?

          • Hi Kurt

            First the Le Page site is quoting and refers to quite an extensive MPBN analysis of $225,000 donation by the Michigan Chamber

            If you follow through to the current website of the Chamber you’ll see that it is not what we all thought think of as a Chamber of Commerce…it is a self described PAC and lobbying group marketing ALEC style laws nationwide and Governors willing to advance such laws. The excellent journalism at the MPBN site provides more detail on that.

            Our metal mining law written by and for the mining industry without regard to modern science and long experience is what the mining industry has been trying to pass all over the U.S.. as other nations clamp down on cyanide heap each mining an open put sulfide mining. The drafts of our law brought in by the mining industry in a last minute almost private audience with the Joint Committee all came from Michigan’s statute word for word. It was clearly the source of the text.

            So from the very beginning. of this trojan horse mining law in the confusion of the late session there has clearly a Michigan connection.

            I have been doing research on where metallic mining is possible in Maine, what we know about the ore and metals there and was particularly interested in what permits and operations have gone forward under existing regs. ( I am preparing testimony on two rule changes..1 by DEP 1 by :LUPC) .and what current immediate interests and intentions there may be,

            Here is a 1979 story in BDN in which JJ Cummings who held a lease of 350,000 on and surrounding Bald Mountain is quoted as saying:

            “An open pit mining, a crushing mill tailing and settling ponds and mining operations by 1984 are expected providing that the developing firms are convinced that metal prices and production costs are favorable and providing environmental license and permit demands are met”

            http://news.google.com/newspapers?nid=2457&dat=19790810&id=agY1AAAAIBAJ&sjid=Tk8KAAAAIBAJ&pg=1087,3678865

            Later Boliden Resouces took over from Cummings ( the had been part of a joint venture created by Cummings). Boliden in 1995 or 6 sold to Black Hawk Mining and LUPC approved a transfer of the exploration permit to Black Hawk. Black Hawk did further exploration as “collaborator” ( the USGS word not mine) with USGS. and in 1999 actually submitted a full scale mining operations plan to “Maine Regulators”

            Here is the USGS report

            http://minerals.usgs.gov/east/environment/me.html

            That report shows hi levels of naturally ocurring arsenkic and other toxins in lakes, rivers and dreams more than 12 Kilometers away..without disturbing the sulfide ore which creates sulphuric acid when exposed to air and water.

            Here is what is described in an announcement from Black Hawk covered in a mining journal about their plans at Bald Mountain

            “December 31, 1999

            Designs for the mine, processing facilities, and tailings landfill have been completed. This work, coupled with the ongoing environmental baseline studies, has formed the basis for a
            comprehensive project development plan which has been submitted for review bythe Maine state regulatory agencies”

            “.April 30, 1998

            Plans were to develop a relatively
            small open pit mine aimed at mining only the gold-enriched gossan. A vat leaching processing system is planned for gold recovery.”

            This is the only economically feasible system for extraction of gold & silver and many nations and many states have forbidden this system. It is actually permitted under existing joint DEP LUPC rules if done through a DPD..specially zoned district.

            Black Hawk was also the developer of the notorious Callahan mine here near me in Blue Hill.. It is now a superfund site ..the bio hazards are still there unremediated from the mine

            Black Hawk is based out of Tornoto.. closer to Michigan than Maine and Black Hawk was just repelled by Michigan from taking up renewed operations using these same techniques

            Again, I encourage, actually beg all citizens of Maine to do this kind of research and to write directly to the agencies with their questions and concerns..to watch what decisions are being made and to make your own assessment of those decisions. Decide for your self through this kid of research who is being served.

            Lindsay Newland Bowker Risk Manager
            NYCDEP 1986-1998

  • Anonymous

    In the end, the Moneymentalists will destroy our earth. I so wish our legislators could take a ride to Aho, Arizona and Butte, Montana to see the castastrophy created by mining. I was once worked in mineral exploration as a budding geologist on the Scott Paper Co. lands – now owned by Plum Creek – and during this time I was aware of the Callahan Mine scam in Blue Hill, Maine. Right from its onset, the Moneymentalists knew that the mine was created merely to manipulate the stock market. Fear the mining Moneymentalists and their newest effort to make a low grade mineral deposit on Irving land in Northern Maine into another environmental disaster. I encourage you all to support the NRC.

    • Anonymous

      You know that mining is the only thing that makes the computer you are typing on and many other things you take for granted possible right?

      • Anonymous

        It is not mining per se that I am opposed to. It is the “methods” of mining. There IS a way to mine a mineral deposit without polluting the ground water and the land. And we have people in our nation who are experts in that procedure. The group just chosen by the State is not the agency I would chose to rewite our current rather loose and nonrestrictive laws.

        • Anonymous

          So who are these people you would approve of? You do know that if you make the process so restrictive as to make it unprofitable you have just in effect banned it right?

          • Anonymous

            This is just what our “current rather loose and nonrestrictive laws” have done, made mining Bald Mountain unprofitable.
            That being said, considering our current political demographics, I don’t belive any mining will occur in Maine, other than gravel pits,granite and small scale gemstones.
            Rewriting the laws is an exercise in futility.

  • Anonymous

    If an environmental group doesn’t like the choice then that’s good enough for me to know that they are a GOOD choice.

  • Anonymous

    The signal-to-noise ratio in the comments about the re-write of the mining rules is discouraging.

    Yes, the North Jackson firm is likely to deliver a “miner’s plan”.

    Yes, if the Natural Resources Council had its way, no mining would occur at Bald Mountain.

    If the process after delivery of the draft rules is long enough and thorough enough, we may be able to get a balanced outcome. Given the geo-chemistry and size of the Bald Mountain project and the need to evaluate the new rules in the context of that proposed mine, a extended comment and review period would seem reasonable.

    • Anonymous

      If NRC had its way, no mining, or farming, or industry or … would take place in Maine.

    • Anonymous

      The rule change does not only apply to Bald Mountain an out of tthe way place to some. These same rules will apply to Chase Mountain and then perhaps in Your Back Yard.

  • Anonymous

    It is only viable because gold prices are so high.. like electric heat is as cheap or maybe cheaper then oil right now.. if the price of gold droped 20% then this wouldn’t be a discussion

  • Anonymous

    Of course an environmental advocacy group is carping about the choice of consultant, It wasn’t them.

  • Anonymous

    This is just saving Irving a lot of money. If the DEP had done its own internal study, Irving would have hired this same company to rebut it. Why not cut out the middleman? But seriously, the issue here is thousands of tons of sulfide rock being mined, crushed up and exposed in giant tailing piles and then causing acidic leachate into native brook trout streams for the next 500 years. If Irving wants the copper so much, then they can haul all the tailings to New Brunswick and let them deal with it. It’s a classic issue of ‘whose problem is it.” Irving wants the valuable stuff, the copper, and wants Aroostook County to have all of the toxic waste left over. They are basically creating a giant toxic waste landfill. Sulphide metal mining of this scale using copper ore of this very low grade cannot be done cleanly unless the ‘host’ community is left with the financial liability for cleaning up the mess after the circus leaves town.

    • Agreed Sir. This is why any mining in bulk requires a rail line to transport the ore to a crusher and refiner. Gee, doesn’t Irving already have 70% of the current abandoned MMA line’s, that Maine DOT’s people now own on the Bond issue, under lease ? And isin’t there a rail line into Canada where Irving, and Canada, can deal with this ? I have no problem with the mining per se but do it responsibly and provide the safeguard’s. West Virginia coal miing company’s finally figured that out when they were forced, under both lawsuit and Court order’s, to reclaim the land and mountain top’s they strip mined. Maine has it’ own mining mess at the Callahan Mine so the abject example is already here. One can hope that DEP is going to require that mess to be used as a standard to measure just what steps, and how well they are going to be used, to keep Bald Mountain fro turning into another mining disaster. Job’s that kill families and children through contaminating the water (anyone remember Love Canal ?) aren’t job’s. They’re just slow motion suicide.

      • Anonymous

        Very well put.

  • Anonymous

    Alexis Wright, the Kennebunk zumba mistress, would have made a better DEP commissioner than Patricia Aho. At least then we would have had an honest prostitute in that position. For those who might not know, for nine years prior to her appointment by the damaged goods salesman who is our governor, Ms. Aho was the chief lobbyist in Maine for both the chemical and petroleum industries.

    • Anonymous

      Lib. at their best. Name calling and insults.

      • Anonymous

        What? You can’t handle the truth?

        • Anonymous

          I can handle the truth. The lib., my way or the highway, from there to name calling and insults. That’s about as true as it gets.

          • Anonymous

            Name calling and insults? If the shoe fits let them wear it. What did I write that wasn’t true, Grandpa? Rather than deal with the truth it is you and your poor teabugger friends who prefer to snarl away about “libs.”

  • Anonymous

    According to the BDN itself, the Superfund clean-up bill from the open-pit Callahan Copper Mine on Cape Rosier in Brooksville is now $23 million and still climbing. Taxpayers are eating most of this. The mine only operated for about 3 years in the early 1970s. Callahan took the copper and left all the toxic tailings for ‘us’ to clean up. When all the expenses are tallied it would have been 20x cheaper to have left the copper and zinc in the ground.

  • Anonymous

    (JOBS) in Maine! What would happen to EBT, Mainecare, free cell phones.Who would watch the OWN channel.Jobs i don’t want no stinkin job environmentalist AKA bored trust fund baby

    • Guest

      Give it up Timmy. EBT cards and MaineCare help folks.
      Ruin your environment and there won’t be any jobs period.

  • Anonymous

    You could have hired Jesus and they would still complain….

  • Anonymous

    Strip mining here we come.

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